Secular Jinnah

Family of the Heart - DIALOGUE & DISCUSSIONS 

Dear  Dr. Maqsood Jafri


In your first comment ( #11:08 ), addressed to me, you divided the people of Pakistan in three categories and the first was composed of:


1--  The atheists, Marxists and the materialists. who do not believe in religion�



In my response ( # 11:14 ), using simple logic that believing and not believing, both depend on Belief, theism and atheism  are religions. If you reject this argument it does not matter. I have already accepted that according to monotheism an atheist is a non-Believer. This is why I have dropped the atheist when I wrote:


An individual Muslim has no right to declare another believer (Marxist and the Materialist), as non-believer.


There is no atheist here, I am simply concerned of the other two.


In response ( # 11:?? ) to this you come back with:


Dear Mr. Ahsan,

Thanks for your kind words. In my opinion the belief is of two types. Rational belief and Blind belief.  When I speak of Islam, I take it as a rational religion. Blind belief is bases on superstitions. Besides, when we say  Mr. A is a believer, it means that he may belong to any religion, but he believes in God. The non- believer means  that a person does not believe in God. So how it comes that you also name an un believer as a believer. You have mixed both  which does not show any sense. Thanks.

Sincerely yours,

Dr. Maqsood Jafri

New York


(This above comment is not posted on FOTH panel??)


In your response (as above) you tried to open a new  discussion concerning Rational Belief. Yes some beliefs can be rational if they have some support of reason and logic. You omit to give any argument to show the rationality of your Religious Belief.


You ignored the Marxist and the Materialist, classified by you as non-believers (11:08).


In my response ( #11:13), I have repeated my question:


But on what reason do you declare the Marxist and Materialist Muslims as non-believers??



Your answer ( # 11:12 ) is:


We can not change established definitions. … According to established norms and definitions…

Besides, you have written that how the Marxists and atheists are non-believers?…�



In my statement (above in colour) there is no question of atheists. Not only you misquote me but you alter my statement according your whims.


It appears that your judgement to treat a Marxist as non-believer is based on some established norms and definitions. I would be happy to learn more from you about these established norms and definitions.


During the Russian occupation, the Central Asian Muslim states (Uzbekistan, Turkmenistan…) , people had Marxist ideology but they always remained Muslims for religious obligations. My mathematics Teacher in college was a Marxist but he was always present for Friday prayers.

There are Marxist Muslims.


Perhaps you have an individual authority based on �established norms and definitions� to declare these Marxists non-believers. Congratulations.


Sincerely yours, 




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